Bootlegs end of an era?

[philobeddo]

I was stunned when i found out about bootleg lp's or import lp's, whatever you wanna call it, back in the end 70's after Elvis' death.

I collected all the beauties like Behind Closed doors, Burbank sessions, Plantation Rock, Dog's Life, New years eve, Sold Out and so on. Later when the CD format went on even better things happened like Bilko, Baxter, 2001, Madison, rock Legends, and so on. In 1999 FTD was there to give the fans material for Elvis fans only. The main reason was to out number the bootleg market. Meanwhile FTD released some of those once bootlegghed shows. And now the complete sessions sets. A lot of us are collectors for years and most of us have these bootleg LP's and CD's. The new generation fans are trying to find out where to get these gems.

Now a days lots of bootleg cd's or lp's are reprints of the old stuff. A plethora of out of copyright material is available. Some steal it direct from official releases. The last one i bought was Houston we have a problem. After that one only one afternoon show from Kanses City was worth buying.

I think the barrel is empty after all those years. Some of the "old" bootleggers are no longer among us. So back to the question yes i think bootlegs are over and an end of an era. I don't know if there is a market for all those simple rip off products like the last ten years. I'm not gonna buy that.

Instead i gave all the old bootleg cd's another spin and really enjoyed it. Brought back good memories about how happy i was when i got them. Still in good shape.

[Rob]

I, too, used to collect a lot of boot LPs back in the day. I bought them from a company in New York called "The King's Voice." I couldn't wait until they arrived and then I'd order another one. Then in the '90s I started collecting the boot CDs. I still purchase occasional audience recordings now days from the likes of Straight Arrow, but, yes, those days are long gone. If I never buy another Elvis related product, I have enough to enjoy the rest of my life.

I like Elvis.

[Renan]

Probably the end of an era.

I'm confident that a few bootlegs may still be released with unreleased material BUT it will depend whether some of this material leak from private collectors. You never know when it may happen.

[Yamaguchi.Y]

Don't think it is quite over, yet . .
(One example that comes to mind is . . I am glad to have the complete Jungle Room Sessions, thanks to bootlegs. Been enjoying those for years now too.)
I think somethings will eventually pop up from time to time and boots will continue to fill in the gaps. (It has definitely slowed down though. FTD has had a lot to do with it, but I am not going to buy even FTDs that have improper speed issues — that's for sure.)

[chop983]

Years ago I bought this Book It taught me not to start on Boots and to start on FTD's instead.

[Greystoke]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I typically bought a lot of CDs at once, as opposed to one or two at a time. And the likes of Elvis in Norway and Jordan's Elvis World were indispensable for exploring what was new or what was available. And Terry always seemed to have what I was looking for. Almost without fail.

I don't think I've bought any bootleg CDs since the mid-2000s, and I sold quite a few around 2008. No regrets. Especially when FTD has bettered most of what I sold. Although there are occasions when a particular show or release comes up in conversation, and I look to find that it's one I sold.

It's changed times now, certainly with the ever-growing FTD catalogue and how easy it is to find uploads on YouTube of concerts once sought after like a Holy Grail, or the stuff dreams are made of. Whilst the care and individuality of once famed labels amongst collectors is surely absent with regards to most bootleg releases now -- certainly bootleg or import rip-offs. But I'm sure there are and will be exceptions, whilst MRS have also come to find a significant place among fans, with some good releases into the bargain.

I don't collect or buy as much as I used to, but I do think it's better for collectors and fans alike now, compared to twenty or thirty years ago. Although the thrill of hearing or finding something new or widely unheard was quite unique and special to that time. Then again, the way FTD releases tend to sell out fairly quickly surely whets the appetite of the most eager collectors and those who don't like to miss out.

It's all there to enjoy regardless. Here's a little stack of mine. And one that I won as a prize from Rob. Does he still post here?! I remember how he used to call me his "little buckaroo."

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[Rob]

Stop blocking me, Hugh!

[Renan]

From above, I still have all these CD's at home. Oh those were such good times!

[pmp]

With FTD, and us only being five years away from a time when all officially-unreleased material is out of copyright in Europe, the era of the Elvis bootleg is certainly coming to a close. Ok, audience recordings might still be released as "bootlegs," but they're hardly bootlegs if the music on them is issues legally.

[CONFEDERATELVIS]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I typically bought a lot of CDs at once, as opposed to one or two at a time. And the likes of Elvis in Norway and Jordan's Elvis World were indispensable for exploring what was new or what was available. And Terry always seemed to have what I was looking for. Almost without fail.

I don't think I've bought any bootleg CDs since the mid-2000s, and I sold quite a few around 2008. No regrets. Especially when FTD has bettered most of what I sold. Although there are occasions when a particular show or release comes up in conversation, and I look to find that it's one I sold.

It's changed times now, certainly with the ever-growing FTD catalogue and how easy it is to find uploads on YouTube of concerts once sought after like a Holy Grail, or the stuff dreams are made of. Whilst the care and individuality of once famed labels amongst collectors is surely absent with regards to most bootleg releases now -- certainly bootleg or import rip-offs. But I'm sure there are and will be exceptions, whilst MRS have also come to find a significant place among fans, with some good releases into the bargain.

I don't collect or buy as much as I used to, but I do think it's better for collectors and fans alike now, compared to twenty or thirty years ago. Although the thrill of hearing or finding something new or widely unheard was quite unique and special to that time. Then again, the way FTD releases tend to sell out fairly quickly surely whets the appetite of the most eager collectors and those who don't like to miss out.

It's all there to enjoy regardless. Here's a little stack of mine. And one that I won as a prize from Rob. Does he still post here?! I remember how he used to call me his "little buckaroo."

Hi Greystoke
I was a regular customer at Spinning Disc myself, spent a small fortune in there in the 80s

[rockinrebel]

The market has been covered really. Even with a previously unreleased soundboard you know what you are getting, and the only real exceptions here would be something like Houston 1970, or a song that we haven't heard in the live setting before.

The studio sessions have been well covered by both the bootleggers and FTD, and FTD's sessions series continues for those that want every last piece of the jigsaw puzzle.

It was a great time to be a fan when new material was appearing on a weekly basis, but most of us now have more titles to dip into and look back on than we ever would of imagined back in the late '70's and early '80's.

It would be fitting if Ernst discovered some missing session reels before he retires, but if that's not the case, I'm more than happy with what I've already got.

[Greystoke]

Hi Greystoke
I was a regular customer at Spinning Disc myself, spent a small fortune in there in the 80s

That's awesome! Definitely fond memories. The catalogue Terry used to send out just came to mind. That was always great to get, especially if something new was in there. I remember getting VHS releases of the Comeback Special outtakes and Elvis in Concert, and the likes of New Year's Eve 1976 on video.

Terry used to drop the occasional freebie in, too. Like these postcards below.

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[drjohncarpenter]

I was stunned when i found out about bootleg lp's or import lp's, whatever you wanna call it, back in the end 70's after Elvis' death.

I collected all the beauties like Behind Closed doors, Burbank sessions, Plantation Rock, Dog's Life, New years eve, Sold Out and so on. Later when the CD format went on even better things happened like Bilko, Baxter, 2001, Madison, rock Legends, and so on. In 1999 FTD was there to give the fans material for Elvis fans only. The main reason was to out number the bootleg market. Meanwhile FTD released some of those once bootlegghed shows. And now the complete sessions sets. A lot of us are collectors for years and most of us have these bootleg LP's and CD's. The new generation fans are trying to find out where to get these gems.

Now a days lots of bootleg cd's or lp's are reprints of the old stuff. A plethora of out of copyright material is available. Some steal it direct from official releases. The last one i bought was Houston we have a problem. After that one only one afternoon show from Kanses City was worth buying.

I think the barrel is empty after all those years. Some of the "old" bootleggers are no longer among us. So back to the question yes i think bootlegs are over and an end of an era. I don't know if there is a market for all those simple rip off products like the last ten years. I'm not gonna buy that.

Instead i gave all the old bootleg cd's another spin and really enjoyed it. Brought back good memories about how happy i was when i got them. Still in good shape.

The records you remember from back in the day were the only things allowing the hard core fans to keep the faith. RCA was mostly failing Presley devotees with lackluster releases under producer Joan Deary.

But yeah, all these years later, and especially because of the thorough, high-quality work of official fan label Follow That Dream, there's not much more left, save memories.

You might also notice that the only "import" label in recent times offering high-quality, unheard material has slowed down to almost zero, and a big reason is the minute copies are out, the material is uploaded to the internet.

But . . . that doesn't mean there is absolutely nothing left to see or hear. But some collectors will not apparently ever let go of their unique images, tapes or films. The value, as in the previous example, is gone once the material surfaces.

It's okay, though.

We'll always have the master release of "Mystery Train," and at least a hundred other stone classics. We'll always have "Singer Presents Elvis!" and "That's The Way It Is" and "Loving You" and "Jailhouse Rock" and "King Creole" and "Viva Las Vegas" and (some of) the 1950s TV appearances, and even "Change of Habit."

[JohnnyByeBye]

The records you remember from back in the day were the only things allowing the hard core fans to keep the faith.

Thinkin back to how iit was in the the 80's, you are dead right. There were some happy isolated exceptions (box sets in 1980 and 1985 come to mind) but boots were really the releases that gave the thrill of getting some new music from Elvis. Without them, the amount of Elvis fans could have been less, coming out of the 80's and 90's.

[Lee Wood]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I worked not far from Spinning Disc and used to buy all my boots from Terry. Occasionally if I was short of money, he'd let me take a few LPs and I'd pay him back later.

I went in one day and he told me that he was selling up and would be opening an on-line business. He'd had enough of the challenges of running a shop. He and his wife would be moving to the West Country. He looked very tired and grey. A couple of days later he died. I went to his funeral in Mortlake. Chris Giles and a few other Elvisy people were there.

[Greystoke]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I worked not far from Spinning Disc and used to buy all my boots from Terry. Occasionally if I was short of money, he'd let me take a few LPs and I'd pay him back later.

I went in one day and he told me that he was selling up and would be opening an on-line business. He'd had enough of the challenges of running a shop. He and his wife would be moving to the West Country. He looked very tired and grey. A couple of days later he died. I went to his funeral in Mortlake. Chris Giles and a few other Elvisy people were there.

I was genuinely saddened when I heard that Terry had passed away. If I remember correctly, I called the shop and asked for Terry, only to be told the sad news. I imagine that he would have thrived online. He seemed like somebody who would have adapted and perhaps even expanded online. Fond times, though.

[Lee Wood]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I worked not far from Spinning Disc and used to buy all my boots from Terry. Occasionally if I was short of money, he'd let me take a few LPs and I'd pay him back later.

I went in one day and he told me that he was selling up and would be opening an on-line business. He'd had enough of the challenges of running a shop. He and his wife would be moving to the West Country. He looked very tired and grey. A couple of days later he died. I went to his funeral in Mortlake. Chris Giles and a few other Elvisy people were there.

I was genuinely saddened when I heard that Terry had passed away. If I remember correctly, I called the shop and asked for Terry, only to be told the sad news. I imagine that he would have thrived online. He seemed like somebody who would have adapted and perhaps even expanded online. Fond times, though.

Yes, likewise.

I got invited to his house in Isleworth a couple of times for a bite to eat, and met his family.

I'm not sure in the end what happened to all his stock. Of course it was an oldies shop, so it was much more than just Elvis.

Here's a pic of Terry I just found on the internet.

Spinning Disc.jpg

[midniteflyer]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I worked not far from Spinning Disc and used to buy all my boots from Terry. Occasionally if I was short of money, he'd let me take a few LPs and I'd pay him back later.

I went in one day and he told me that he was selling up and would be opening an on-line business. He'd had enough of the challenges of running a shop. He and his wife would be moving to the West Country. He looked very tired and grey. A couple of days later he died. I went to his funeral in Mortlake. Chris Giles and a few other Elvisy people were there.

I was genuinely saddened when I heard that Terry had passed away. If I remember correctly, I called the shop and asked for Terry, only to be told the sad news. I imagine that he would have thrived online. He seemed like somebody who would have adapted and perhaps even expanded online. Fond times, though.

Yes, likewise.

I got invited to his house in Isleworth a couple of times for a bite to eat, and met his family.

I'm not sure in the end what happened to all his stock. Of course it was an oldies shop, so it was much more than just Elvis.

Here's a pic of Terry I just found on the internet.

Thanks for finding that picture Lee,I remember standing at that counter for many an hour chatting to Terry about Elvis and the import market.The good thing about Spinning Disc was it was a goldmine for finding second hand classic bootlegs but Terry could source the latest material too.

Memphis Memories was my first bootleg and from then on every Saturday I drove to Chiswick (as a new driver in my old Ford Cortina this was a major trip) to trawl through so much vinyl and try and get as much as my spare cash could afford.

As time moved on I lost touch with Terry and was saddened to read on this forum of his premature passing,I am always thankful to Terry for helping build my collection and his time and patience with this eager to learn everything fan.

[LSP-4445]

Now a days lots of bootleg cd's or lp's are reprints of the old stuff. A plethora of out of copyright material is available. Some steal it direct from official releases. The last one i bought was Houston we have a problem. After that one only one afternoon show from Kanses City was worth buying.

I think the barrel is empty after all those years. Some of the "old" bootleggers are no longer among us. So back to the question yes i think bootlegs are over and an end of an era. I don't know if there is a market for all those simple rip off products like the last ten years. I'm not gonna buy that.

Apart from some good Venus label releases over the years the bootleg scene is 100% dead to me now,and that for at least 10 years.
And the last two Venus releases have been very poor so I dont see them coming back in full force either.

[GLAISTER]

Bootlegs - end of an era ? I think yes - and I think no - but sadly more "yes" than "no" for reasons detailed below.

I think yes, simply because the obvious source of material for the best of the boots - RCA's archives - is now itself more or less empty. I would not be surprised if EJ is hanging onto a few things he may have located without telling anyone - there is the 50th anniversary to think about, and how to commemorate it, and I am sure he is thinking ahead to that point in time which, let's face it, is likely to be the last anniversary that receives any kind of special treatment.

So, I think the end of that era - the era of studio outtakes and multi-track live recordings is almost certainly behind us, if for no other reason then simply for lack of suitable existent material.

Then there is the collectors market for rare material. Here, I think we are probably talking about material from the '50's, probably bits and pieces which were recorded along the way at various radio stations along with maybe a few live performances, and later rehearsals and more live recordings which we know exist but which remain elusive to us more mainstream collectors. But I don't hold out too much hope here either, as the owners of such material would either want the kind of return that is simply out of reach with the limited distribution of boots, or else would simply prefer to keep their unheard-by-anyone-else-material to themselves, which is always their prerogative.

That said, I think there is still a market for good quality audience recordings but I think that is likely to be it - but then, one never knows, life is full of surprises and the Elvis world is certainly no exception.

So, if we are ever going to hear a SUN era 'Tiger Man' (without meaning to restart that debate again) or 'Uncle Penn' I think it is more likely going to be on an official release rather than a boot.

I too remember the '70's and '80's bootleg scene, which was a hell of a lot more exciting than most of what RCA was churning out at the time. In fact, there was a period between about '84 and '88 when I barely listened to Elvis at all, preferring to reach out and explore other artists instead. My own interest was re-awakened when EJ took over, with the first three "Essential" albums grabbing my interest, and then keeping my interest with firstly "Collectors Gold" and then the '50's box set (the latter of which I received in the same post as the first two Fort Baxter releases - no one packet of CD's ever got better than that!). Anyway from that point on, I was back in the fold and we all know what a glorious period the next 15 years or so were for both bootleg and official releases.

With the first generation of fans now sadly leaving us, and with the second generation like me pushing 60 and knocking on the wrong doors for a few years now, I think we must all be prepared to accept the sad reality that unless we are extremely lucky, the bootleg era will continue slowly through an-already-decade-old long demise.

On a footnote, as Terry Jones and his wonderful Spinning Disc shop in west London has been mentioned in this topic, I too have fond memories of the man. He was a lovely guy, who genuinely cared and I too spent many hours leaning against that counter and talking - and learning - all things Elvis with him. He helped me kick start my collection, not just boots but RCA stuff as well, and he will never be forgotten - a true gentleman.

Interesting topic, good one for posting.

[Lee Wood]

Good times! I avidly bought bootleg releases in the nineties and early part of this century, before turning my focus to FTD for a while. I used to buy from Terry at the Spinning Disc in Chiswick, and always intended to visit his shop, but never did. Terry was always great to speak to on the phone and he was fair with his prices, and fast with his deliveries.

I worked not far from Spinning Disc and used to buy all my boots from Terry. Occasionally if I was short of money, he'd let me take a few LPs and I'd pay him back later.

I went in one day and he told me that he was selling up and would be opening an on-line business. He'd had enough of the challenges of running a shop. He and his wife would be moving to the West Country. He looked very tired and grey. A couple of days later he died. I went to his funeral in Mortlake. Chris Giles and a few other Elvisy people were there.

I was genuinely saddened when I heard that Terry had passed away. If I remember correctly, I called the shop and asked for Terry, only to be told the sad news. I imagine that he would have thrived online. He seemed like somebody who would have adapted and perhaps even expanded online. Fond times, though.

Yes, likewise.

I got invited to his house in Isleworth a couple of times for a bite to eat, and met his family.

I'm not sure in the end what happened to all his stock. Of course it was an oldies shop, so it was much more than just Elvis.

Here's a pic of Terry I just found on the internet.

Thanks for finding that picture Lee,I remember standing at that counter for many an hour chatting to Terry about Elvis and the import market.The good thing about Spinning Disc was it was a goldmine for finding second hand classic bootlegs but Terry could source the latest material too.

Memphis Memories was my first bootleg and from then on every Saturday I drove to Chiswick (as a new driver in my old Ford Cortina this was a major trip) to trawl through so much vinyl and try and get as much as my spare cash could afford.

As time moved on I lost touch with Terry and was saddened to read on this forum of his premature passing,I am always thankful to Terry for helping build my collection and his time and patience with this eager to learn everything fan.

That shop was a real little Aladdin's cave. I was always there in the week as I worked in Isleworth and would therefore often pass it on my way to meetings.