Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:57 am wrote:To the ones on here who just can't seem to grasp this possibility......do you honestly believe that Elvis could be so lame brained that he would mistakenly think a song that never became a record ,was his record ?

How did he manage a 23 year career and not know what he recorded ?

Answer is he did remember everything he recorded .There's no other instance where he said he recorded something he didn't.

But we have this one song he says he did and we don't have it in our collections so instead of thinking of that great track record of knowing what he recorded ,it's assumed by some that he's wrong because he also said "X" was his second record and he said "Y" was in 56 instead of 58.

He was a showman for sure ,a jokester and liked playing with words but he knew his recorded history and if he says Tigerman was a record(or an acetate) then that's good enough for me.

Lost treasures get found a long long time after they are assumed gone for ever or assumed they never existed.
This August will mark eight years since I took the time and trouble to put everything together, and not one person has been able to diminish the compelling nature of what Elvis specifically said and did on stage in August 1970. In case anyone missed it then, I created this topic on the 40th anniversary of one of the nights when the singer shared a truth with the audience.

Maybe someday we will be able to thank him for doing that.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Hard Rocker »

No getting away from the fact that you said Elvis MUST have recorded Tiger Man at Sun, which clearly is an opinion which holds no water A-Tall. And that's all that matters.
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Re: Elvis Recorded

Post by Domino »

rjm on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:32 am wrote:I have to agree with the idea that he did it somewhere else. He may have been frustrated with Phillips. But not at a "recording service." I think Sam's full featured service was unique in town. Billy Emerson went on record saying he and Elvis made demos in a radio station. These demos inevitably ended up with Sam anyway, and he would discard what he didn't like or need. No Elvis version is in existence today.

The only station doing this was WDIA. A small payment was made to demo singers.

To me, this is the only way for it all to come together. The second record he EVER made!

It's important to look at the date of release of the Rufus Thomas hit. It's really, really close to "My Happiness." But it was recorded on June 30, less than a couple weeks before My Happiness. That's a problem unless Elvis sang it immediately after hearing it, or immediately upon release. OR Elvis was less shy than we ever knew and made a demo before My Happiness. (Utterly unlikely. But when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever is left, no matter how improbable, must be the truth. We're not there yet. But it's still worth investigating what all went down on the QT at WDIA in the back room. Thomas was a DJ there.)

Now, why do I think this? Because it is almost exactly what also happened with Mystery Train. An earlier Sun Release with "Burns" as co-writer. An earlier, different version by Joe Hill Louis, and like Mystery Train, the very first version is slower and languid. Elvis "goosed it up." Tiger Man was "goosed up." Rufus Thomas used to say he was "loose as a goose" on his radio show.

Again, Tiger Man also began life as a slower, more languid song. It also was "goosed up" by another artist. And the fast tune was a hit. But if Elvis really did do demos at "a radio station" with Elvis also singing demos, then we have something truly more interesting than even hearing it. I am not interested in hearing it. I just want to know. My belief is that it was cut at some point in July (at the latest) and discarded by Sam. That Elvis did exactly the same thing with Mystery Train is intriguing!

Why did Elvis so often combine these two songs if one had nothing to do with him? And sometimes only do Tiger Man, and did it differently. Why?

That station was a simple drive down Union Avenue. But Sam was the only real game in town.

What I am about to say next is wild. Take it in that spirit.

What if the Memphis Recording Service was NOT the first place Elvis sang "My Happiness"? He sure sounded rehearsed and polished to me. What if BOTH Sam and Marion were correct? Sam heard a demo of My Happiness, threw it away, and Marion put it on a piece of tape.

That could allow for Tiger Man to be his second record *ever* recorded, also thrown away.

Food for thought.

rjm
P.S. -- It's 4:30 in the morning and I may be dreaming. LOL

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Kind of reminds me of something I wrote pages back.
I thought after My Happiness was done and he wasn't hearing back from Sun ,thinking Sam must have not thought much of ballads so he goes someplace else like maybe WDIA and does something faster like Tigerman (the second record) and get's laughed out of the place so he puts that bad experience out of his mind.Doesn't talk about it.Then goes back to Sun to try a second ballad disc which would actually be the third disc .After a little while later gets a call back thinking the ballad must be Sam's thing after all.
He runs through every ballad he knows and it's not working.Confused ,he gives the faster song a second try thinking Sam has a more open mind.Does That's All Right and as they say,the rest is history.
8) "Well sir,to be honest with you,we just stumbled upon it." - 1954
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by poormadpeter2 »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:57 pm wrote: How did he manage a 23 year career and not know what he recorded ?
How did he not remember that his first single was not My happiness? If you had his career, would YOU remember the name of the song that started it all?
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Domino »

poormadpeter2 on Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:14 pm wrote:
Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:57 pm wrote: How did he manage a 23 year career and not know what he recorded ?
How did he not remember that his first single was not My happiness? If you had his career, would YOU remember the name of the song that started it all?

If he didn't remember his first single then he would have opened his shows with My Happiness.
He never says they put out "My Happiness".He's got a limited amount of time to talk.The audience doesn't care how accurate it is.He's shortening the story and at no point does he say he recorded "My Happiness" and then "My Happiness" was the first single.
8) "Well sir,to be honest with you,we just stumbled upon it." - 1954
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by poormadpeter2 »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:25 pm wrote:
poormadpeter2 on Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:14 pm wrote:
Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:57 pm wrote: How did he manage a 23 year career and not know what he recorded ?
How did he not remember that his first single was not My happiness? If you had his career, would YOU remember the name of the song that started it all?

If he didn't remember his first single then he would have opened his shows with My Happiness.
He never says they put out "My Happiness".He's got a limited amount of time to talk.The audience doesn't care how accurate it is.He's shortening the story and at no point does he say he recorded "My Happiness" and then "My Happiness" was the first single.

He says quite clearly he made a demo and eighteen months late Sam Phillips put it out and it was a local hit.

Night after night he said it.

You can't somehow twist it to make it sound that he wasn't talking complete BS.
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Re: Elvis Recorded

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:02 pm wrote:Kind of reminds me of something I wrote pages back.

I thought after My Happiness was done and he wasn't hearing back from Sun ,thinking Sam must have not thought much of ballads so he goes someplace else like maybe WDIA and does something faster like Tigerman (the second record) and get's laughed out of the place so he puts that bad experience out of his mind.Doesn't talk about it.Then goes back to Sun to try a second ballad disc which would actually be the third disc .After a little while later gets a call back thinking the ballad must be Sam's thing after all.

He runs through every ballad he knows and it's not working.Confused ,he gives the faster song a second try thinking Sam has a more open mind.Does That's All Right and as they say,the rest is history.
For all the reasons I wrote earlier today in reply to rjm, this is all simply not feasible.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by poormadpeter2 »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:04 pm wrote:
poormadpeter2 on Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:01 pm wrote:
Domino on Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:41 pm wrote:
poormadpeter2 on Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:48 am wrote:
drjohncarpenter on Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:35 am wrote:
fn2drive on Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:33 pm wrote:
drjohncarpenter on Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:59 pm wrote:The topic is posed as a question. If or when it is solved I'll make sure you're the first to know. The rest of your concerns are thoroughly addressed in the preceding pages.

Since this is your very first post on my crucial topic, do take the time to read what every good member shared in this discussion.

Unfortunately, as you delve into page 1 and beyond, you will encounter more than a little trolling from some of the usual suspects. Please do your best to ignore their posts. If I could I would delete every single one of them, as they are a waste of everyone's time.
What and deny us the laughs and chuckles that come along with reading their silliness. Say it isn’t so.
If I could I would collect all of them, and make it a standalone topic.
I'll do it myself if you like, but you wouldn't like it as my evidence is far more compelling than your own - and if that wasn't the case, you wouldn't keep trying to suppress it.
Here's a fact.
We have no idea how many songs they run through and thought this would be a great second record.
So you might say why didn't he call a bunch of other songs his second record.
Maybe this was the one that stuck in his mind.
Maybe this was the one that came closest to being the second record.
Your evidence doesn't answer any of these possibilities.
Our evidence is the man WHO WAS THERE saying this was his second record.
Non of the experts like Jorgensen or Guralnick who researched this can say it absolutely didn't happen.They have his words and can't find the paper trail so they can say it absolutely did .
Was Scotty or Sam ever asked straight out "did you record Tigerman and did you think it might be the second record ?"
Does anyone know ?
If we have Sam's words saying it wasn't recorded or in the running to be second record then I'd say the case is closed.
If we don't have Sam's words then we still have Elvis's words and I hope someday another audience recording is found where he explains better what he means.
Do you actually read ANYTHING that is written on a thread you respond to?

NO-ONE has ever said that Tiger Man was not tried out at Sun.
NO-ONE has ever said that Tiger Man was not recorded at Sun.
NO-ONE has even said that Tiger Man could not have been considered as Elvis's second record.

Do you understand this so far?

Good.

Now, here's the complicated part.

What is being objected to is the following:
Somehow, though, Elvis, Scotty and Bill must have cut a version of "Tiger Man" as a possible follow-up to "That's All Right" (Sun 209), and then producer Sam Phillips pressed acetates for evaluation. Thus the origin of Elvis' "second record" that "not too many people heard" reference.

In any event, history proves that "Tiger Man" was passed over for "Good Rockin' Tonight" and lost to history after Sun 210 hit the market.

But ... where are those acetates today?

Did Elvis keep a copy for his own collection?
The Doc isn't suggesting that something might have happened, or that Tiger Man probably was recorded. He is telling that it DID happen, that it MUST be the case, that Phillips MUST have pressed acetates of a recording we don't even know for sure occurred at any point during Elvis's time at Sun, let alone at this particular point in time.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND NOW?


People are objecting to the Doc giving a concrete decision on what happened, when, and how. They are not objecting to the possibility that Tiger Man was cut or tried out at Sun.

The Doc was asked to rephrase that opening post, but he did not. Had he done so, this topic would have ended after five pages. But that is clearly not what he wanted.

The difference between possibilities and things that undoubtedly happened are quite clear, and they are not principals that should be difficult to grasp.

Yes I do read what looks worth reading.
So what your saying is ...
Elvis COULD have recorded Tigerman.
Elvis COULD be telling the truth.
Elvis MIGHT not be all mixed up like you think he is.
So basically your squawking over one word. The word "must."
You squawked for 80 plus pages over the word "must."
Time to move one.
Well at least you are beginning to grasp the concept.

But not quite.

I am happy to admit that Elvis probably tried out or recorded tiger man at Sun. I have said that from the beginning.

But the idea of taking his stage comments at face value when he continually exaggerated/lied/got things wrong on stage is the issue. He announced Mystery Train as his second record too. We know this but it is ignored.

There is no evidence or any reason to suggest that acetates were made it that a useable take of the song was cut. Absolutely nothing unless you are willing to accept that my happiness was released as a single and a regional hit.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by BobDylan »

Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:25 pm wrote:
poormadpeter2 on Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:14 pm wrote:
Domino on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:57 pm wrote: How did he manage a 23 year career and not know what he recorded ?
How did he not remember that his first single was not My happiness? If you had his career, would YOU remember the name of the song that started it all?

If he didn't remember his first single then he would have opened his shows with My Happiness.
He never says they put out "My Happiness".He's got a limited amount of time to talk.The audience doesn't care how accurate it is.He's shortening the story and at no point does he say he recorded "My Happiness" and then "My Happiness" was the first single.
Are you sure about that? After 87 pages we're STILL arguing over what he said and how accurate or not he was or could be.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Keith »

Greg1995 on Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:21 pm wrote:I don't know is this of any importance to anybody but I'll say it anyway.
Three months ago I talked to a guy who runs a german funclub and is also a big private collector.
I asked about "Tiger Man" recording possibility and he said "No".
He had brought up this question to a man who was responsible at SUN
for running recording equipment while Sam was in a recording booth.
What was the guy's name who worked at Sun?

I wonder why the OP hasn't responded to your post?

Because it goes against everything he is trying to prove in this thread!

:wink:

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Greg1995 »

How about leaving this topic (a lot of arguments were discussed here in 8 years period, we have no new info)
until some relevatory proof or information will (eventually) come up in the future and THEN we can discuss??
You guys here have milked every possible circumstances and possibilities, this adds nothing without an evidence.
I have nothing against discussion but this thread has turned into a boxing ring a long time ago.

As of now: there is no SUN version of "Tiger Man" by Elvis Presley!

How about cherishing 1955 live version of "Danny Boy" performed by Elvis Presley, which we know has been recorded, but eraised??
This one we know actually EXISTED at some point!
Last edited by Greg1995 on Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by poormadpeter2 »

Greg1995 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:40 pm wrote:How about leaving this topic (a lot of arguments were discussed here in 8 years period, we have no new info)
until some relevatory proof or information will (eventually) come up in the future and THEN we can discuss??
You guys here have milked every possible circumstances and possibilities, this adds nothing without an evidence.
I have nothing against discussion but this thread has turned into a boxing ring a long time ago.

As of now: there is no SUN version of "Tiger Man" by Elvis Presley!

How about cherishing live 1955 version of "Danny Boy" performer by Elvis Presley, which we know has been recorded, but eraised ??
We know this one EXISTED!
The thread was bumped a week or so ago by the OP, with no extra info or evidence. Just for the attention.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Greg1995 »

Keith on Sat Apr 21, 2018 11:37 pm wrote:
Greg1995 on Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:21 pm wrote:I don't know is this of any importance to anybody but I'll say it anyway.
Three months ago I talked to a guy who runs a german funclub and is also a big private collector.
I asked about "Tiger Man" recording possibility and he said "No".
He had brought up this question to a man who was responsible at SUN
for running recording equipment while Sam was in a recording booth.
What was the guy's name who worked at Sun?

I wonder why the OP hasn't responded to your post?

Because it goes against everything he is trying to prove in this thread!

:wink:

Keith
He might have or not told me the name. Either way I don't remember.
Last edited by Greg1995 on Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by mike edwards66 »

rjm wrote:
mike edwards66 wrote:
Ciscoking wrote:All speculation. But its fine by me.

Hard evidence like ..paperwork..audio..eye witness..newspaper reports..would be better..though..

OK. When Elvis said "that was my second record, that I ever recorded" he was speaking literally. After recording "My Happiness" at Sun with Marion Keisker at the helm, and whilst waiting hopefully for Sam Phillips to contact him, Elvis made a second record at another recording service.

Hence, no paperwork at Sun and hence, Elvis' cryptic reference "not too many people heard it". In August 1970, one of the few people that had "heard it" showed up, hung around for a while and sparked Elvis' memory.


1972 - Elvis reconfirms, in a matter of fact manner, that "Tiger Man" was the "second record" that he "ever recorded".


1970 - Elvis refers to "Tiger Man" as the second record he ever recorded, and gives a cryptic clue that "not too many people heard it". This is because one of the few people that had "heard it" showed up, hung around for a while and sparked Elvis' memory.


1968 - A statement of intent. After years in the "wilderness", Elvis is telling us that, contrary to what we may have heard, he is the still the king of the jungle!


1953/4 - After recording "My Happiness" at Sun with Marion Keisker at the helm, and whilst waiting hopefully for Sam Phillips to contact him, Elvis made a second record, the second that he ever recorded, at another recording service. Outside the box, but totally plausible. As Ernst Jorgensen noted "...weeks and months went by and he (Elvis) heard nothing.......he couldn't stand it anymore.."
I have to agree with the idea that he did it somewhere else. He may have been frustrated with Phillips.
Thank you. It makes perfect sense and all the pieces fit. No paperwork at Sun and Elvis' cryptic reference "not too many people heard it". Having got the bug, Elvis would have been itching to record again. As Ernst Jorgensen noted "...weeks and months went by and he (Elvis) heard nothing.......he couldn't stand it anymore.."
>>>


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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Greg1995 »

I saw James Burton in January.
I had in my mind to ask him when giving autographs
if Elvis said anything about the song when he brought it to rehearsals in 69'.
I did not... Dammit!

James1954

Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by James1954 »

There is absolutely no chance that Presley went to any other recording facility to record anything. I grew up in the region, I knew many of the people that were there at the time and who knew Presley. If he had done anything someone would have said something, someone would have tried to cash-in. Before Sun's breakthrough there were very few places in the area to record, in the latter part of the fifties there were over 80 labels in the Memphis region but Presley was already at RCA. WDIA was only interested in African American performers and would have advised Presley to go and see Sam Phillips, Lillian McMurry at Trumpet in Mississippi, Sun's competitor, had very little interest in white performers and preferred dealing with more experienced artists. Meteor, where several Sun performers moonlighted, is a possibility but the Biharis would have released anything they had on Presley and it would have been found by now.

The Memphis scene was extremely tight and small, if Presley was going around to other facilities people would have talked about it merely because he was so weird - Presley was known around Memphis and he was considered pretty strange, and Memphis had its share of weirdos. The reason he took off in Texas first was that his style of dressing and music was much more common there, he fit right in. Much of this topic is just fantasy without any background knowledge.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

James1954 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:20 pm wrote:There is absolutely no chance that Presley went to any other recording facility to record anything. I grew up in the region, I knew many of the people that were there at the time and who knew Presley. If he had done anything someone would have said something, someone would have tried to cash-in. Before Sun's breakthrough there were very few places in the area to record, in the latter part of the fifties there were over 80 labels in the Memphis region but Presley was already at RCA. WDIA was only interested in African American performers and would have advised Presley to go and see Sam Phillips, Lillian McMurry at Trumpet in Mississippi, Sun's competitor, had very little interest in white performers and preferred dealing with more experienced artists. Meteor, where several Sun performers moonlighted, is a possibility but the Biharis would have released anything they had on Presley and it would have been found by now.

The Memphis scene was extremely tight and small, if Presley was going around to other facilities people would have talked about it merely because he was so weird - Presley was known around Memphis and he was considered pretty strange, and Memphis had its share of weirdos. The reason he took off in Texas first was that his style of dressing and music was much more common there, he fit right in. Much of this topic is just fantasy without any background knowledge.
Thanks for underscoring what I already wrote in a VERY detailed reply to rjm, and her thoughtful post a page back. Did you see it?

It is not feasible Elvis recorded anywhere other than Sun in 1953-1954. We know for a fact he did record elsewhere in 1955.

"Much of this topic is just fantasy without any background knowledge."

I have no idea what this comment means, as these facts have been made plain in the course of the discussion:

- Elvis adored the song "Tiger Man" from the moment it was released on Sun Records
- Elvis listened to WDIA Radio in Memphis, knew the disc jockeys and the music
- Elvis attended the WDIA Benefit shows in December 1956 and December 1957
- Sam Phillips made acetates of unreleased songs cut by Elvis for disc jockeys to preview on-air
- The majority of the small combo songs rehearsed or done live in June 1968 were from 1954-1957
- Elvis rehearsed "When It Rains It Pours" with the small combo in June 1968, and in 1983 a Sun recording of it was released
- Elvis rehearsed and performed "Tiger Man" live in June 1968
- The 1968 performance of "Tiger Man" was issued on LP in November 1968
- The 1968 performance of "Tiger Man" was seen by millions on national TV in August 1969
- Elvis performed, at minimum, EIGHT stand-alone live versions of "Tiger Man" in August 1970
- Each of these stand-alone live versions had pointed, serious introductions where he called it his "second record"
- More "second record" introductions where he sings "Tiger Man" are found on sporadic live recordings in 1971 and 1972
- There are no known, stand-alone live versions of "Mystery Train" from July 1969 to June 1977
- No other introductions are known of Elvis calling something a "second record" without a performance of "Tiger Man" involved

All of these things deserve serious consideration, but if you believe this is "just fantasy" I cannot agree.
Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by mike edwards66 »

James1954 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 11:20 pm wrote:There is absolutely no chance that Presley went to any other recording facility to record anything. I grew up in the region, I knew many of the people that were there at the time and who knew Presley. If he had done anything someone would have said something, someone would have tried to cash-in.
They could only have cashed-in if they knew about it. If the young Elvis had walked into a 'facility' with, like the Memphis Recording Service, just one person minding shop. If he had walked in, threw his 4 bucks or whatever on the counter, cut a record and left, no one, or at least 'not too many people' would have known about it.

But, what we are dealing with here, is making sense from what Elvis said in 1970 (and again in 1972). Namely, that Tiger Man was the second record he ever recorded.

In that respect, I offer that when Elvis said "that was my second record, that I ever recorded" he was speaking literally. After recording "My Happiness" at Sun with Marion Keisker at the helm, and whilst waiting hopefully for Sam Phillips to contact him, Elvis made a second record at another recording service.

Hence, no paperwork at Sun and hence, Elvis' cryptic reference "not too many people heard it".

This would tie-in perfectly with Ernst Jorgensen noted "...weeks and months went by and he (Elvis) heard nothing.........he couldn't stand it anymore.."

In August 1970, perhaps one of the few people that had "heard it" showed up, hung around for a while and sparked Elvis' memory.
>>>


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James1954

Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by James1954 »

There were no other record your own song facilities in Memphis at the time. Your next post will be "Oh, he could have gone to Atlanta. Or here or there." It's a fantasy based on an alternative world and no facts, fake news in fact.

John - I accept the facts you present, not the conclusions you reach. I was referring to the fantasy turn it has taken where facts of the period are being disregarded - recording elsewhere. I apologise for the blanket statement regarding the whole topic. I do think Elvis could have messed around with Tiger Man at Sun and maybe it was recorded, but the tape is lost or wiped over. I did take the pledge.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by mike edwards66 »

James1954 wrote:There were no other record your own song facilities in Memphis at the time. Your next post will be "Oh, he could have gone to Atlanta. Or here or there." It's a fantasy based on an alternative world and no facts, fake news in fact.
My next post is "You're missing the point". What we are dealing with here, is making sense from what Elvis said in 1970 (and again in 1972). Namely, that Tiger Man was the second record he ever recorded.
>>>


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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Domino »

mike edwards66 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 7:51 pm wrote:
James1954 wrote:There were no other record your own song facilities in Memphis at the time. Your next post will be "Oh, he could have gone to Atlanta. Or here or there." It's a fantasy based on an alternative world and no facts, fake news in fact.
My next post is "You're missing the point". What we are dealing with here, is making sense from what Elvis said in 1970 (and again in 1972). Namely, that Tiger Man was the second record he ever recorded.

I still like this line of thinking.It really does fit with what Elvis says.A record between the 1st and 2nd records at Sun makes it a second record.
But if there was no place around to do this then it kind of puts us back to square 1.
8) "Well sir,to be honest with you,we just stumbled upon it." - 1954
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James1954

Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by James1954 »

mike edwards66 on Sun Apr 22, 2018 11:51 am wrote:
James1954 wrote:There were no other record your own song facilities in Memphis at the time. Your next post will be "Oh, he could have gone to Atlanta. Or here or there." It's a fantasy based on an alternative world and no facts, fake news in fact.
My next post is "You're missing the point". What we are dealing with here, is making sense from what Elvis said in 1970 (and again in 1972). Namely, that Tiger Man was the second record he ever recorded.
It was stage patter and Elvis was mistaken, as performers often are when they are in the eye of a hurricane as he was. There is no sense other than than southern story telling, we bend the facts to suit the story we'd like. Your dogs ain't huntin'.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by rjm »

Someone did talk about it. Billy Emerson.

They weren't supposed to be back there. But maybe Emerson misremembered. We will never know.

For me, this thread is important because it is how I discovered FECC. I heard the audio samples on a dialup connection before that hard drive died and I was THRILLED!

So I have been very intrigued by the topic ever since. At the time, I was listening to a lot of pre-Elvis Sun, especially from 1953. And I wondered what the heck happened with the driven young Searcher during that frustrating time. With a car, Memphis isn't as big as you might think. And Elvis couldn't give a rat's behind about Jim Crow since he was a child. He went wherever he wanted to go.

Perhaps he loved the record, sang it a lot, but never cut it. Maybe he thought it was captured on a Sun radio demo in 1954. We have not many outtakes even of the songs he did get released. You can't fault any of us fans for wanting to know more about 1953-1954. After that, we know almost everything. See, that's the adventure! Some Mystery Trains disappear into the dark night, precious cargo aboard, never to return. But we remember the ghostly train.

By mid 1955, Elvis was so good, he stopped a train in his version of the old folk line about the long black train that was 16 coaches long. "took my baby/never will again . . . whooo!"

rjm
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

James1954 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:39 pm wrote:There were no other record your own song facilities in Memphis at the time. Your next post will be "Oh, he could have gone to Atlanta. Or here or there." It's a fantasy based on an alternative world and no facts, fake news in fact.

John - I accept the facts you present, not the conclusions you reach. I was referring to the fantasy turn it has taken where facts of the period are being disregarded - recording elsewhere. I apologise for the blanket statement regarding the whole topic. I do think Elvis could have messed around with Tiger Man at Sun and maybe it was recorded, but the tape is lost or wiped over. I did take the pledge.
Thanks so much. I am really enjoying your posts, please contribute as often as possible. We need folks like you to balance out the discussions here. As you can tell, they get a little crazy sometimes.

I suspect no tape can possibly exist. But an acetate ...
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Scarre »

rjm on Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:13 am wrote:Someone did talk about it. Billy Emerson.

They weren't supposed to be back there. But maybe Emerson misremembered. We will never know.

For me, this thread is important because it is how I discovered FECC. I heard the audio samples on a dialup connection before that hard drive died and I was THRILLED!

So I have been very intrigued by the topic ever since. At the time, I was listening to a lot of pre-Elvis Sun, especially from 1953. And I wondered what the heck happened with the driven young Searcher during that frustrating time. With a car, Memphis isn't as big as you might think. And Elvis couldn't give a rat's behind about Jim Crow since he was a child. He went wherever he wanted to go.

Perhaps he loved the record, sang it a lot, but never cut it. Maybe he thought it was captured on a Sun radio demo in 1954. We have not many outtakes even of the songs he did get released. You can't fault any of us fans for wanting to know more about 1953-1954. After that, we know almost everything. See, that's the adventure! Some Mystery Trains disappear into the dark night, precious cargo aboard, never to return. But we remember the ghostly train.

By mid 1955, Elvis was so good, he stopped a train in his version of the old folk line about the long black train that was 16 coaches long. "took my baby/never will again . . . whooo!"

rjm
A very short playlist...