Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by pmp »

Domino wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:57 pm
pmp wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 4:45 pm
jeanno wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:31 am
Elvis mentioned it too many times to be just a joke: that 1954 recording (demo, rehearsal, outtake, whatever) plus the 1955 pied pipper film and the 1969 rehearsal are probably the holy grails of Elvis Presley's music.
And how many times did he tell the story about the underground 8mm film in 1969 shows. It surely couldn't be a joke if he mentioned that many times, right? So, do you believe that, too?
Right for a short time in 1969 his monologue bit included the 8mm film ,but then it was gone .Never returned.
But the second record bit returned 2 years later and amazingly was the same record that was being called the second record.
This poor singer with the faulty memory was able to recall part of his monologue when all he had to do was remember the lyrics to his songs.Or maybe it wasn't recalling part of his monologue. Maybe he was recalling a memory .A memory that never changed from year to year.

Maybe all he did wrong was leave out the words "was going to be" .
That is not true. When the second record comment returned, it was before the Mystery Train/Tiger Man medley, which only lends weight to the argument that Elvis was referring to Mystery Train and not Tiger Man from the outset, but had somehow got mixed up.

Either way, as I repeat for the umpteenth time, nobody is arguing about the notion that it was tried out at Sun. It more than likely was. What they arguing with is the following from the opening post:
Somehow, though, Elvis, Scotty and Bill must have cut a version of "Tiger Man" as a possible follow-up to "That's All Right" (Sun 209), and then producer Sam Phillips pressed acetates for evaluation. Thus the origin of Elvis' "second record" that "not too many people heard" reference.
There is absolutely no evidence or proof or likelihood that Phillips pressed acetates and that it was pencilled in as the second record. Nothing.

But hey, the Doc won't retract it because he likes the attention the thread receives every six months when he comes along to needlessly resurrect it.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by pmp »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:57 pm
pmp wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:14 am
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:00 am
Didn't you self-publish a book on Elvis' music? If so, you better delete that post quick.

I won't bother with most of your comments, as they are your usual mix of error and speciousness. Most of your attacks have already been made in the previous pages here already, and each has been thoroughly and completely dismissed.

Yes. And it's well-researched ...


:D
And I ask again, where is your book, oh fount of all knowledge? Nowhere. But hey, your reviews under a pseudonym could be compiled into a pamphlet, I guess.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by PiersEIN »

pmp wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:19 am
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:57 pm
pmp wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:14 am
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:00 am
Didn't you self-publish a book on Elvis' music? If so, you better delete that post quick.

I won't bother with most of your comments, as they are your usual mix of error and speciousness. Most of your attacks have already been made in the previous pages here already, and each has been thoroughly and completely dismissed.

Yes. And it's well-researched ...


:D
And I ask again, where is your book, oh fount of all knowledge? Nowhere.
But hey, your reviews under a pseudonym could be compiled into a pamphlet, I guess.
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:27 am
Elvis adored the song "Tiger Man"
- Elvis listened to KDIA Radio, knew the disc jockeys and the music
- Elvis attended the KDIA Benefit shows in 1956 and 1957
Yes indeed a neat pamphlet where Elvis regularly went to 'KDIA' Radio Goodwill shows! :smt003

And it is nice to see drjohncarpenter thanking me for helping him update his incorrect facts. ::rocks
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Steve Morse »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:03 pm
jetblack wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:29 pm
Yet we KNOW 'Tiger Man' was NOT Elvis second record. That would be 'I'll Never Stand In Your Way' / 'It Wouldn't Be The Same (without you)'. Or technically 'That's When Your Heartaches Begin' being the second song cut at 706 Union Avenue in July 1953.

Wrong.

You should leave this discussion as, AGAIN, it is evident you have not bothered to read this discussion topic.

You're just blowing hot air and wasting our time.

You may excel at these two things, but that doesn't mean anyone else appreciates it.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

jeanno wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:31 am
Elvis mentioned it too many times to be just a joke: that 1954 recording (demo, rehearsal, outtake, whatever) plus the 1955 pied pipper film and the 1969 rehearsal are probably the holy grails of Elvis Presley's music.


BTW, where is that new avatar from?



Image



It's quite appealing. :D
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by jeanno »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:06 am
jeanno wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:31 am
Elvis mentioned it too many times to be just a joke: that 1954 recording (demo, rehearsal, outtake, whatever) plus the 1955 pied pipper film and the 1969 rehearsal are probably the holy grails of Elvis Presley's music.


BTW, where is that new avatar from?



Image



It's quite appealing. :D
Looks like this new cover art hit the nail of this particular thread!
It's a rhythm & blues comp focusing on those 1967 / 1971 magical years with TIGER MAN as a linking theme song.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by AndrewJ »

Here's a bit of conjecture to think about - maybe the reference to Tiger Man as a 'second' song is a red herring? Could the medley with Mystery Train indicate that it was at this later session that it was tried out? So maybe it was slated to be a later release? Also, could this cut have been tried out with drums - Johnny Bernero was on this session, or maybe at the I'm Left, You're Right Session with Jimmy Lott? The existence of the test acetate of the slow version of I'm Left You're Right She's Gone (slow version) shows that Sam Phillips was in the habit of doing this at this point, so may have pressed a Tiger Man acetate then?

As I said - just a bit of conjecture. The Mystery Train has been highlighted in previous posts - so maybe the reason for the medley was the fact Elvis remembered recording them together? Could it be possible that Tiger Man was rejected as a possible 5th/6th Sun single?
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

AndrewJ wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:08 pm
Here's a bit of conjecture to think about - maybe the reference to Tiger Man as a 'second' song is a red herring? Could the medley with Mystery Train indicate that it was at this later session that it was tried out? So maybe it was slated to be a later release? Also, could this cut have been tried out with drums - Johnny Bernero was on this session, or maybe at the I'm Left, You're Right Session with Jimmy Lott? The existence of the test acetate of the slow version of I'm Left You're Right She's Gone (slow version) shows that Sam Phillips was in the habit of doing this at this point, so may have pressed a Tiger Man acetate then?

As I said - just a bit of conjecture. The Mystery Train has been highlighted in previous posts - so maybe the reason for the medley was the fact Elvis remembered recording them together? Could it be possible that Tiger Man was rejected as a possible 5th/6th Sun single?


I love your suggestions, but I don't think any are feasible.

When Elvis said "Tiger Man" almost became his "second record," he clearly meant his second release for Sun, after "That's All Right" came out in July 1954. That he would perform it alone at the summer 1970 engagement after saying this only underscores his point. Earlier that month, it was delivered in the medley with "Mystery Train" which Presley introduced at the International a year before, and would revisit as the 1970s progressed.

At the time Sam Phillips was working with Elvis on a followup to Sun 209, August-September 1954, neither Jimmy Lott nor Johnny Bernero were involved. "Tiger Man" could indeed have been revived in later sessions in 1954 or 1955, but this isn't what Elvis is talking about on stage in the summer of 1970, and sporadically after that in 1971-1972.

Sam was interviewed many times about the majestic, otherworldly "Mystery Train," which of course was the last from Elvis on Sun. Never once did he ever mention "Tiger Man" being in the running for that single, or after. A possible sixth Sun release has often been said to be "When It Rains It Pours" on one side, and perhaps "We're Getting Closer (To Being Apart)" on the other. The latter was not recorded at Sun by Presley, although songwriter Charlie Feathers always claimed it was being planned that way.

Thanks for some intelligence discourse on this very popular FECC topic.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

jeanno wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:09 am
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:06 am
BTW, where is that new avatar from?



Image



It's quite appealing. :D


Looks like this new cover art hit the nail of this particular thread!
It's a rhythm & blues comp focusing on those 1967 / 1971 magical years with TIGER MAN as a linking theme song.




It did indeed! It's great, thank you.

Is it available in larger size, perhaps for one to print up?

It's clear many here might like to do that. :D
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by pmp »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:42 pm
I love your suggestions, but I don't think any are feasible.

When Elvis said "Tiger Man" almost became his "second record,"
Where does he say "almost?"

These are your transcriptions of his comments:
1. "That was called 'Tiger Man,' that was the second record I ever recorded."
2. "The second record that I ever recorded was called "Tiger Man."
3. "One of, the second record that I recorded was a song called 'Tiger Man,' not too many people heard it."
4. "The second record that I ever recorded, uh, ladies and gentlemen, the story isn't too well known, but not too many people heard it but ... it's called 'Tiger Man.'"
5. "That was called 'Tiger Man,' that was the second record I ever recorded."
6. "The second record that I ever recorded, when I first started out in the business, was called 'Tiger Man.' And, uh (applause), you heard of it? Not too many people did."
7. "I did a song back when I first started out. Not too many people heard it, because I wasn't well-known at the time. My mother and daddy knew me but, uh, (laughs) ... said "Who's that?" ... the sideburns (ack)... uh, anyway, there was this song, it's called 'Tiger Man.' It goes like this ... uh, it's called 'Tiger Man."
8. "The second song that I ever recorded, not too many people heard it because I wasn't too well-known and, uh, it's called 'Tiger Man'."
So where does he say it "almost" became his second recording? He doesn't say that at all. He says that it WAS his second record. So, now you're literally making stuff up.

And he also says in (7) and (8) that people didn't hear it because he "wasn't too well-known." He's not saying people didn't hear it because it wasn't actually the second record he put out. Therefore we have to assume that the record was released, as that's precisely what he's saying.

So, now we are in a position where you want us to accept that Elvis was telling the truth when he was saying these 8 comments. BUT you also want us to NOT believe the statements because you and I both know that the record never came out, AND because the reason people didn't hear it had nothing whatsoever to do with him not being well-known.

And let's also note that (7) doesn't involve him mentioning it being a record at all, but just a song from when he started out. Going by that comment, he could easily have been singing it live at the time but not in the studio.

So, which is it, Doc? Are we believing Elvis's comments or not? You can't pick and choose which bits you believe.
Last edited by pmp on Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by DEH »

He says not many people heard it because he wasn't well known. So is he saying it was out there for people to hear???? If he is then it's BS.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by DEH »

pmp wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:14 am
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:42 pm
I love your suggestions, but I don't think any are feasible.

When Elvis said "Tiger Man" almost became his "second record,"
Where does he say "almost?"

These are your transcriptions of his comments:
1. "That was called 'Tiger Man,' that was the second record I ever recorded."
2. "The second record that I ever recorded was called "Tiger Man."
3. "One of, the second record that I recorded was a song called 'Tiger Man,' not too many people heard it."
4. "The second record that I ever recorded, uh, ladies and gentlemen, the story isn't too well known, but not too many people heard it but ... it's called 'Tiger Man.'"
5. "That was called 'Tiger Man,' that was the second record I ever recorded."
6. "The second record that I ever recorded, when I first started out in the business, was called 'Tiger Man.' And, uh (applause), you heard of it? Not too many people did."
7. "I did a song back when I first started out. Not too many people heard it, because I wasn't well-known at the time. My mother and daddy knew me but, uh, (laughs) ... said "Who's that?" ... the sideburns (ack)... uh, anyway, there was this song, it's called 'Tiger Man.' It goes like this ... uh, it's called 'Tiger Man."
8. "The second song that I ever recorded, not too many people heard it because I wasn't too well-known and, uh, it's called 'Tiger Man'."
So where does he say it "almost" became his second reading? He doesn't say that at all. He says that it WAS his second record. So, now you're literally making stuff up.

And he also says in (7) and (8) that people didn't hear it because he "wasn't too well-known." He's not saying people didn't hear it because it wasn't actually the second record he put out. Therefore we have to assume that the record was released, as that's precisely what he's saying.

So, now we are in a position where you want us to accept that Elvis was telling the truth when he was saying these 8 comments. BUT you also want us to NOT believe the statements because you and I both know that the record never came out, AND because the reason people didn't hear it had nothing whatsoever to do with him not being well-known.

And let's also note that (7) doesn't involve him mentioning it being a record at all, but just a song from when he started out. Going by that comment, he could easily have been singing it live at the time but not in the studio.

So, which is it, Doc? Are we believing Elvis's comments or not? You can't pick and choose which bits you believe.
You are killing it PMP. ::rocks
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Steve Morse wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:59 pm
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Hope you feel better soon.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Rtn 2 Sndr »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:42 pm

Sam was interviewed many times about the majestic, otherworldly "Mystery Train," which of course was the last from Elvis on Sun. Never once did he ever mention "Tiger Man" being in the running for that single, or after. A possible sixth Sun release has often been said to be "When It Rains It Pours" on one side, and perhaps "We're Getting Closer (To Being Apart)" on the other. The latter was not recorded at Sun by Presley, although songwriter Charlie Feathers always claimed it was being planned that way.
If I remember correctly from my reading of "Elvis: A Life In Music", "Tryin' To Get To You" was the leading contender as a possible sixth single on Sun.

At the time Elvis' contract was sold to RCA, the search was on for a flip side. In the liner notes for the Bear Family "Sun Country Years" box set, Charlie Feathers indicated that the song was pitched to Elvis. No evidence has surfaced indicating the fate of the song. It may have been that Elvis and/or Sam decided that the song wasn't right for Elvis, or perhaps it was tried out and was either not recorded or did not survive on tape.

Either way, it seems that Elvis had already moved on to another idea: "When It Rains It Pours". The surviving tape that was released in its entirety on "A Boy From Tupelo" is interesting in that it captures the conversation between Sam & Elvis as they try to work out an approach to the song. Sam had already released the song as a single by Billy "The Kid" Emerson, and perhaps it was his idea for Elvis to try the song. As the tape rolls, Sam is coaching Elvis on the tempo at which he thought the first line should be sung. The session was cut short, but Elvis filed away the idea for the arrangement until he recorded the song for RCA in 1957.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Buddy »

90 pages full of "coffee grounds reading". But ok if Elvis has said he recorded Tiger Man, it HAS to be the truth.
By the way he also said ON STAGE -before going to the piano- there will be a forth comming new album of him, "called Unchained Melody"...
Another mystery to be solved, .
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Mike Windgren »

Hi there!! :D :D :D.
Buddy wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:55 am
90 pages full of "coffee grounds reading". But ok if Elvis has said he recorded Tiger Man, it HAS to be the truth.
By the way he also said ON STAGE -before going to the piano- there will be a forth comming new album of him, "called Unchained Melody"...
Another mystery to be solved, .
You made my day, thanks! :smt005. Bye for now :smt006.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:40 am
If I remember correctly from my reading of "Elvis: A Life In Music", "Tryin' To Get To You" was the leading contender as a possible sixth single on Sun.

At the time Elvis' contract was sold to RCA, the search was on for a flip side. In the liner notes for the Bear Family "Sun Country Years" box set, Charlie Feathers indicated that the song was pitched to Elvis. No evidence has surfaced indicating the fate of the song. It may have been that Elvis and/or Sam decided that the song wasn't right for Elvis, or perhaps it was tried out and was either not recorded or did not survive on tape.

Either way, it seems that Elvis had already moved on to another idea: "When It Rains It Pours". The surviving tape that was released in its entirety on "A Boy From Tupelo" is interesting in that it captures the conversation between Sam & Elvis as they try to work out an approach to the song. Sam had already released the song as a single by Billy "The Kid" Emerson, and perhaps it was his idea for Elvis to try the song. As the tape rolls, Sam is coaching Elvis on the tempo at which he thought the first line should be sung. The session was cut short, but Elvis filed away the idea for the arrangement until he recorded the song for RCA in 1957.


Great post.

You're quite right that "Tryin' to Get to You" was a finished master Sam Phillips had in the can since the summer, and would've made for an excellent A-side.

The FTD release of "When It Rains It Pours" -- from the reel used to create Scotty Moore's guitar slapback sound -- was not released in its entirety, but very close.

I agree it's very possible Sam brought Billy's single to Elvis' attention, although we know the singer loved all the r&b that Sun had issued.

To add to the extent that Presley and "Tiger Man" was a 1954 memory like no other, I was just alerted to a fan report made in the summer of 1973, after seeing his 8-20-1973 DS in Las Vegas:


August 20 1973 Dinner Show

Review by Wendy Murton & Friends


Basically Elvis' shows have a fixed pattern in that he starts with a couple of rock numbers, includes a rock'n'roll sequence, some "kissing" songs for the girls, and finishes with 'Can't Help Falling In Love', but that does not mean to say that any two shows are the same.

A lot of people who have read the list of songs asks if each show is the same as Elvis does some numbers for practically the whole season, but with Elvis this just can't be. It depends on the audience and it depends on how Elvis feels that show.

[snip]

This show he spent a great deal of time over to the right, much to our disappointment, because we were sat to the left, but Wendy managed to get a scarf even so.

Was 'Tiger Man' really Elvis' second record? - he keeps saying so.


Rex Martin's "Worldwide Elvis News Service Weekly" #123 - October 10, 1973
https://www.keithflynn.com/essential_lists/concerts-1973.html


Anyone have the audio for this show?

Three full years since those summer 1970 recordings, the memory is still right there for "Tiger Man."

There is nothing in his live recorded canon that can match the significance of this.

As every good fan already well knows.

:smt023
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Domino »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:01 pm
Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:40 am
If I remember correctly from my reading of "Elvis: A Life In Music", "Tryin' To Get To You" was the leading contender as a possible sixth single on Sun.

At the time Elvis' contract was sold to RCA, the search was on for a flip side. In the liner notes for the Bear Family "Sun Country Years" box set, Charlie Feathers indicated that the song was pitched to Elvis. No evidence has surfaced indicating the fate of the song. It may have been that Elvis and/or Sam decided that the song wasn't right for Elvis, or perhaps it was tried out and was either not recorded or did not survive on tape.

Either way, it seems that Elvis had already moved on to another idea: "When It Rains It Pours". The surviving tape that was released in its entirety on "A Boy From Tupelo" is interesting in that it captures the conversation between Sam & Elvis as they try to work out an approach to the song. Sam had already released the song as a single by Billy "The Kid" Emerson, and perhaps it was his idea for Elvis to try the song. As the tape rolls, Sam is coaching Elvis on the tempo at which he thought the first line should be sung. The session was cut short, but Elvis filed away the idea for the arrangement until he recorded the song for RCA in 1957.


Great post.

You're quite right that "Tryin' to Get to You" was a finished master Sam Phillips had in the can since the summer, and would've made for an excellent A-side.

The FTD release of "When It Rains It Pours" -- from the reel used to create Scotty Moore's guitar slapback sound -- was not released in its entirety, but very close.

I agree it's very possible Sam brought Billy's single to Elvis' attention, although we know the singer loved all the r&b that Sun had issued.

To add to the extent that Presley and "Tiger Man" was a 1954 memory like no other, I was just alerted to a fan report made in the summer of 1973, after seeing his 8-20-1973 DS in Las Vegas:


August 20 1973 Dinner Show

Review by Wendy Murton & Friends


Basically Elvis' shows have a fixed pattern in that he starts with a couple of rock numbers, includes a rock'n'roll sequence, some "kissing" songs for the girls, and finishes with 'Can't Help Falling In Love', but that does not mean to say that any two shows are the same.

A lot of people who have read the list of songs asks if each show is the same as Elvis does some numbers for practically the whole season, but with Elvis this just can't be. It depends on the audience and it depends on how Elvis feels that show.

[snip]

This show he spent a great deal of time over to the right, much to our disappointment, because we were sat to the left, but Wendy managed to get a scarf even so.

Was 'Tiger Man' really Elvis' second record? - he keeps saying so.


Rex Martin's "Worldwide Elvis News Service Weekly" #123 - October 10, 1973
https://www.keithflynn.com/essential_lists/concerts-1973.html


Anyone have the audio for this show?

Three full years since those summer 1970 recordings, the memory is still right there for "Tiger Man."

There is nothing in his live recorded canon that can match the significance of this.

As every good fan already well knows.

:smt023

Pretty cool
Now we have him doing the second record bit in 1973.

Nice to see there was someone paying attention back then.Gives hope that there's something waiting to be unearthed that adds a little more to what Elvis is saying.
8) "Well sir,to be honest with you,we just stumbled upon it." - 1954
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by DEH »

He says not many people heard it because he wasn't well known. So is he saying it was out there for people to hear???? If he is then it's BS.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by AndrewJ »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:01 pm
Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:40 am
If I remember correctly from my reading of "Elvis: A Life In Music", "Tryin' To Get To You" was the leading contender as a possible sixth single on Sun.

At the time Elvis' contract was sold to RCA, the search was on for a flip side. In the liner notes for the Bear Family "Sun Country Years" box set, Charlie Feathers indicated that the song was pitched to Elvis. No evidence has surfaced indicating the fate of the song. It may have been that Elvis and/or Sam decided that the song wasn't right for Elvis, or perhaps it was tried out and was either not recorded or did not survive on tape.

Either way, it seems that Elvis had already moved on to another idea: "When It Rains It Pours". The surviving tape that was released in its entirety on "A Boy From Tupelo" is interesting in that it captures the conversation between Sam & Elvis as they try to work out an approach to the song. Sam had already released the song as a single by Billy "The Kid" Emerson, and perhaps it was his idea for Elvis to try the song. As the tape rolls, Sam is coaching Elvis on the tempo at which he thought the first line should be sung. The session was cut short, but Elvis filed away the idea for the arrangement until he recorded the song for RCA in 1957.


Great post.

You're quite right that "Tryin' to Get to You" was a finished master Sam Phillips had in the can since the summer, and would've made for an excellent A-side.

The FTD release of "When It Rains It Pours" -- from the reel used to create Scotty Moore's guitar slapback sound -- was not released in its entirety, but very close.

I agree it's very possible Sam brought Billy's single to Elvis' attention, although we know the singer loved all the r&b that Sun had issued.

To add to the extent that Presley and "Tiger Man" was a 1954 memory like no other, I was just alerted to a fan report made in the summer of 1973, after seeing his 8-20-1973 DS in Las Vegas:


August 20 1973 Dinner Show

Review by Wendy Murton & Friends


Basically Elvis' shows have a fixed pattern in that he starts with a couple of rock numbers, includes a rock'n'roll sequence, some "kissing" songs for the girls, and finishes with 'Can't Help Falling In Love', but that does not mean to say that any two shows are the same.

A lot of people who have read the list of songs asks if each show is the same as Elvis does some numbers for practically the whole season, but with Elvis this just can't be. It depends on the audience and it depends on how Elvis feels that show.

[snip]

This show he spent a great deal of time over to the right, much to our disappointment, because we were sat to the left, but Wendy managed to get a scarf even so.

Was 'Tiger Man' really Elvis' second record? - he keeps saying so.


Rex Martin's "Worldwide Elvis News Service Weekly" #123 - October 10, 1973
https://www.keithflynn.com/essential_lists/concerts-1973.html


Anyone have the audio for this show?

Three full years since those summer 1970 recordings, the memory is still right there for "Tiger Man."

There is nothing in his live recorded canon that can match the significance of this.

As every good fan already well knows.

:smt023
Apparently, the show where these comments were made was recorded on SB - might have been better to release this on the upcoming FTD 'Las Vegas 1973'?
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by chop983 »

Isn't he back to the medley version here.

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by AndrewJ »

chop983 wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:18 pm
Isn't he back to the medley version here.
Yes, from the track listings I've seen it looks like it was mostly performed in medley with Mystery Train. According to Elvisconcerts.com there was also a reprise slow version on 11th August M/S.

He performed Mystery Train/Tiger Man on 21 occasions throughout the August-September 1973 stand at the Hilton.

7th August MS
9th August MS
10th August DS & MS
11th August MS (plus slow reprise of Tiger Man alone)
12th August MS
18th August DS & MS
19th August DS
20th August DS & MS
21st August DS
23rd August MS
25th August DS
27th August MS
28th August MS
31st August MS
2nd September MS & 3am
3rd September DS & CS

Just need to check all existing audio from these shows to see if he comments on the 'second record'.
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Domino »

DEH wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:06 am
He says not many people heard it because he wasn't well known. So is he saying it was out there for people to hear???? If he is then it's BS.
He's saying not many heard it because it was just a demo.Maybe was just a tape for a few to hear like Dewey or the band.Just because he calls it a record doesn't mean it's an actual released record.He also calls My Happiness a record and we know it isn't.So it's not BS.
8) "Well sir,to be honest with you,we just stumbled upon it." - 1954
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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by Ciscoking »

chop983 wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:18 pm
Isn't he back to the medley version here.
To be honest..I dont care about this story any more..I am just tired about it. .and .I grew older. ..in this case..there is zero evidence..too..no audio proof is available..so all is speculation....and it will always be..till we die hardcore fans will be dead in some 10 or 20 years..then..nobody will give 2 sh..ts..about this construction..any more..besides the grave..of a doctor..where..a sign had been set..saying.."still waiting for the Tiger Man acetate ..he won`t rest in peace "..a record player would stand. For 50 cents this audio proof would be played

Second second record

The benefit of it would be collected for further research.
Thanks to Ernst Joergensen, Roger Semon and Erik Rasmussen for the great work. Keep the spirit alive !

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Re: Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?

Post by DEH »

The second record I ever recorded in my life. In 1912...Mystery Train.