Ready for an AI-Boosted ‘Sun Sessions’? Inside the Elvis Presley Archives with Ernst Jorgensen

[sweetangeline]

posted today;

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/ready-ai-boosted-sun-sessions-183755488.html

In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

[TINML]

Bring it on, especially if it's the crew that did Get Back and not Matt Ross-Spang.

[drjohncarpenter]

posted today;

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/ready-ai-boosted-sun-sessions-183755488.html

In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

Interesting stuff from Rolling Stone magazine and journalist Brian Hiatt.

AI is the rage, so it's no surprise that Ernst is open to considering use of it on the archives. But the key right now is cost. It is VERY expensive to use Peter Jackson’s proprietary AI technology.

Is SONY willing to spend the money? What happens if they do, and the results are awful? Do they release the stuff anyway?

We shall see.

Also, unsure if Hiatt misheard or Ernst misremembered what's written in Steve Sholes' 1955 notes on the Sun tapes that RCA received when they acquired Presley's contract. Sholes clearly notes "2" selections, not one. And since the comment is followed by a question mark, it means he wasn't even sure about them.

Box No. 2. Work Parts on F2WW-8040 and 2 other selections ?

suntapes.jpg

Source: http://www.elvisrecordings.com



Anyway, it's a mystery that may never be solved. Such a shame.

_____


The Rolling Stone article includes a "new" 1956 color photo, taken on location during the making of "Love Me Tender," so I'm including the whole thing below. Like the quiet nod to the Jackson-Beatles connection in the sub-heading ("Here Comes The Sun").

Here Comes the Sun

Ready for an AI-Boosted ‘Sun Sessions’? Inside the Elvis Presley Archives

As the latest Presley archival release, Memphis, suggests, there are still discoveries to be made in Presley's archives — and a more radical future may be ahead

By Brian Hiatt
October 22, 2024

elvis-presley-archives.jpg

A large number of Elvis Presley's 1950s outtakes are lost forever, according to producer/archivist Ernst Jorgensen
Screen Archives/Getty Images


In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

Looks like Elvis isn't thrilled with the idea of using AI on his original Sun tapes.


'

elvis-presley-archives.jpg

[Gary Crawford]

posted today;

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/ready-ai-boosted-sun-sessions-183755488.html

In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

Interesting stuff from Rolling Stone magazine and journalist Brian Hiatt.

AI is the rage, so it's no surprise that Ernst is open to considering use of it on the archives. But the key right now is cost. It is VERY expensive to use Peter Jackson’s proprietary AI technology.

Is SONY willing to spend the money? What happens if they do, and the results are awful? Do they release the stuff anyway?

We shall see.

Also, unsure if Hiatt misheard or Ernst misremembered what's written in Steve Sholes' 1955 notes on the Sun tapes that RCA received when they acquired Presley's contract. Sholes clearly notes "2" selections, not one. And since the comment is followed by a question mark, it means he wasn't even sure about them.

Box No. 2. Work Parts on F2WW-8040 and 2 other selections ?

Source: http://www.elvisrecordings.com



Anyway, it's a mystery that may never be solved. Such a shame.



_____


The Rolling Stone article includes a "new" 1956 color photo, taken on location during the making of "Love Me Tender," so I'm including the whole thing below. Like the quiet nod to the Jackson-Beatles connection in the sub-heading ("Here Comes The Sun").

Here Comes the Sun

Ready for an AI-Boosted ‘Sun Sessions’? Inside the Elvis Presley Archives

As the latest Presley archival release, Memphis, suggests, there are still discoveries to be made in Presley's archives — and a more radical future may be ahead

By Brian Hiatt
October 22, 2024




A large number of Elvis Presley's 1950s outtakes are lost forever, according to producer/archivist Ernst Jorgensen
Screen Archives/Getty Images


In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

Looks like Elvis isn't thrilled with the idea of using AI on his original Sun tapes.


'

Do we know how Harbour Lights and When It Rains It Really Pours survived the tape purge? Random chance? However, given they would know these tapes had not been released, were they kept for this reason and if so why not Satisfied.....?

[Walter Hale 4]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

[On Tape 1972]

Elvis-fans are the luckiest sons-a-bitches in the world and oftentimes don't realize it. Awesome news, thanks for sharing @sweetangeline! Way to go, Ernst!!

[steve in sc4]

…..and there you have it. We now know what the 50th anniversary mainstream release will be in 2027.

[TCB-FAN]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

I would listen to the newly mixed tracks out of curiosity, but I'd certainly won't buy it. How many times does a fan have to buy the same songs over and over ????

[Keith Richards, Jr.]

I don’t care. I don’t care about the remixed versions on ”Memphis” either. I have the original masters and will keep listening to those.

I think the original story and the original music will become ever more distorted in the future.

But as long as they keep AI away from unreleased soundboards, I’m fine with whatever they decide to do.

[Wayne]

posted today;

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/ready-ai-boosted-sun-sessions-183755488.html

In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

Interesting stuff from Rolling Stone magazine and journalist Brian Hiatt.

AI is the rage, so it's no surprise that Ernst is open to considering use of it on the archives. But the key right now is cost. It is VERY expensive to use Peter Jackson’s proprietary AI technology.

Is SONY willing to spend the money? What happens if they do, and the results are awful? Do they release the stuff anyway?

We shall see.

Also, unsure if Hiatt misheard or Ernst misremembered what's written in Steve Sholes' 1955 notes on the Sun tapes that RCA received when they acquired Presley's contract. Sholes clearly notes "2" selections, not one. And since the comment is followed by a question mark, it means he wasn't even sure about them.

Box No. 2. Work Parts on F2WW-8040 and 2 other selections ?

Source: http://www.elvisrecordings.com



Anyway, it's a mystery that may never be solved. Such a shame.

_____


The Rolling Stone article includes a "new" 1956 color photo, taken on location during the making of "Love Me Tender," so I'm including the whole thing below. Like the quiet nod to the Jackson-Beatles connection in the sub-heading ("Here Comes The Sun").

Here Comes the Sun

Ready for an AI-Boosted ‘Sun Sessions’? Inside the Elvis Presley Archives

As the latest Presley archival release, Memphis, suggests, there are still discoveries to be made in Presley's archives — and a more radical future may be ahead

By Brian Hiatt
October 22, 2024




A large number of Elvis Presley's 1950s outtakes are lost forever, according to producer/archivist Ernst Jorgensen
Screen Archives/Getty Images


In the late Eighties, Ernst Jorgensen, then an executive at a BMG affiliate in Denmark, raised an impertinent question in an international meeting. “How come we treat the Elvis Presley catalog so poorly?” The response from a U.S. label chief was immediate: “If you’re so smart, why don’t you do it?”

Jorgensen has been in charge of Presley reissues ever since, from the groundbreaking 1992 collection The King of Rock N’ Roll — The Complete 50s Masters to the just-released box set Memphis, which gathers recordings from the Tennessee city the star called home for most of his life. And when the technology’s ready, Jorgensen is hoping for an ambitious, AI-fueled reworking of Presley’s 1950s masterpieces, starting with his epochal recordings at Sun Studios between 1954 and 1956.

Presley’s Sun Studios sessions, with guitarist Scotty Moore and bassist Bill Black, were recorded live to single-track mono tape by label owner Sam Phillips, which means any real remixes of the songs have always been impossible. But AI demixing technology — which allows instruments to be separated from a single track — keeps advancing. Jorgensen recently asked Emile de la Rey, who worked on the sound for Peter Jackson’s Get Back documentary, to do a test remix of “Good Rockin’ Tonight” using Jackson’s proprietary AI technology. The results, “a perfect separation of instruments” along with the removal of tape hiss, were far superior to any more widely available machine-learning methods, so Jorgensen is waiting for access to that level of technology. Once he’s got it, he says, “I’d like to do everything from the Fifties. Because even the Sun recordings, they are very simple. There’s an acoustic and electric and a slap bass. But when you open that up, it’s still like a new revelation. It’s not like it becomes thin and you think, ‘Oh, is that all there is?'”

Jorgensen has spent decades hunting down and digitizing Presley’s master tapes, but some have eluded him. He’s had to use second-generation or worse sources for a few of the Sun songs that the label never sent to RCA, including “Blue Moon of Kentucky,” and even worse, the outtakes from those sessions are gone forever. “There’s a tape called ‘”That’s All Right” and One Other Selection,’ but it doesn’t say what the selection is, and the tape was destroyed,” he says. There are also missing tracks from Presley’s RCA-era recordings later that decade: “Some president of RCA Records in 1959 came up with a brilliant idea to save some money in the warehousing bit of the company. So they dumped about 10,000 or 20,000 tapes, including outtakes of Elvis’s sessions.”

No AI was used on the Memphis box set, but it does include remixed versions of classic tracks — “In the Ghetto,” “Suspicious Minds,” and “Kentucky Rain” among them — with overdubs stripped out by producer/engineer Matt Ross-Spang. “Those are some of the greatest musicians of all time, backing up Elvis,” Ross-Spang says. “And you get to hear all the little nuances, and you really get to hear Elvis’ voice and know that’s pretty much what it sounded like in the room while it’s being recorded.” Ross-Spang used analog equipment as much as possible in his Memphis-based Southern Grooves Studio, including an actual, physical echo chamber for vocal treatment.

Ross-Spang also remixed live recordings from Memphis in the Seventies, which posed some technical challenges. “It can be tough when Elvis is going around and singing and he’s by the drums,” he says. “So then the vocal mic is all drums. And then he goes over to the crowd and you hear girls screaming. But all that to me is more excitement.”

The final section of the Memphis set includes selections from the so-called Jungle Room Sessions in 1976, Presley’s final recordings. Though they were laid down by a declining Presley the year before his death, there are a surprising number of highlights, including an emotive, if over-sung, take on “Danny Boy.” “They show a more focused Elvis than people think,” Ross-Spang says. “You can hear how engaged and driven he was during those recordings.”

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/elvis-presley-memphis-archives-ai-sun-sessions-1235139403/

Looks like Elvis isn't thrilled with the idea of using AI on his original Sun tapes.


'

Here is a larger, uncropped version of the Love Me Tender image:

1621658408.jpg

[portlandjulian]

Thank you for sharing. A interesting read.

[On Tape 1972]

Sam Philips would have recorded Elvis in stereo, had the tech been available. And so would the folks at RCA. The Peter Jackson technology is the real deal and has nothing to with 1980's reprocessed stereo. It's also far superior to what the last few versions of iZotope RX are able to achieve (which is pretty amazing). The technology basically allows us to go back in time and record Elvis, Scotty & Bill on multiple tracks.

Doesn't "From Me To You" sound like a very truthful and authentic stereo-recording by The Beatles?

[elvis-fan]

I don’t care. I don’t care about the remixed versions on ”Memphis” either.

I don't care if the sun don't shine...

[Erhan]

I hope they can eliminate Alan Fortas's terrible drum noise from 1968 comeback sitdown shows with that AI technology one-day...


Tapatalk kullanarak iPhone aracılığıyla gönderildi

[Gary Crawford]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

You could look at it this way. The original sun mono recording is not actually itself a true reflection of the historical music making that took place in Sun Studio's. The music would have been heard by Sam and co with 2 ears and not as one single mono mixed stream of sound with 2 guitars, a vocal and a stand up base. It would only be changing history if they were adding anything to it that Elvis, Scotty and Bill did not put down on wax in 54/55. If the AI technology can convincingly just recreate the stereo sound that RCA was doing a few short years later anyway then why not? Any results may not have the charm of the original mono mixes for sure. However it will be different and just another representation of the historical music that was recorded. The originals ain't going anywhere.

[RickGreekElvis]

Count me in. I'm all for it.

[minkahed]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

You could look at it this way. The original sun mono recording is not actually itself a true reflection of the historical music making that took place in Sun Studio's. The music would have been heard by Sam and co with 2 ears and not as one single mono mixed stream of sound with 2 guitars, a vocal and a stand up base. It would only be changing history if they were adding anything to it that Elvis, Scotty and Bill did not put down on wax in 54/55. If the AI technology can convincingly just recreate the stereo sound that RCA was doing a few short years later anyway then why not? Any results may not have the charm of the original mono mixes for sure. However it will be different and just another representation of the historical music that was recorded. The originals ain't going anywhere.

Exactly. I feel the same.

As long as the original recordings are available, (and in great sound), this actually might be a fun alternative.

[emjel]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

But if they do it, the originals will still be there. They won’t get rid of them so you can enjoy whatever turns you on.

[Walter Hale 4]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

But if they do it, the originals will still be there. They won’t get rid of them so you can enjoy whatever turns you on.

good one emjel,

that's not the point.

It would be unethical to play around with Elvis, Scotty, Bill, DJ Fontana and Sam Phillips artistic integrity. The Sun records are sacred and should be left as they were.

Another angle to look at this; when you are producing a mono-to-stereo job, what determines what instrument goes to the left side? what determines what instrument goes to the right side? And on later RCA masters where do you pan the Jordanaires vocals to?.... was Ernst there?
Would it all be based on researched guesswork or subjective decisions according to what sounds best to the given producer's ear?

[Walter Hale 4]

I have an opposite angle, why aren't more of us calling Ernst out on the lack of 2 or 3 cd box of Elvis' sixties and early 70's authentic Mono singles as produced by RCA? These are a glaring omission in the Elvis recorded legacy.

Shame that more of us aren't complaining about it.

[drjohncarpenter]

Do we know how Harbour Lights and When It Rains It Really Pours survived the tape purge? Random chance? However, given they would know these tapes had not been released, were they kept for this reason and if so why not Satisfied.....?

Both "Harbor Lights" and "When It Rains It Pours" survived because they were not sent to RCA's storage facility in Indianapolis in 1957. They were only kept by happenstance. No one felt they were releasable items until producer Joan Deary went looking for unissued material.

"Satisfied" was lost because it was on one of the 8 reels sent to storage. Sadly some of the original Sun reels, and some of RCA's copies of these reels, were NOT sent to Indianapolis, and yet are still LOST. Painful.

See more here:

Master & Session: Sun Recordings
http://www.elvisrecordings.com/sun.htm

[sweetangeline]

It would be unethical to play around with Elvis, Scotty, Bill, DJ Fontana and Sam Phillips artistic integrity. The Sun records are sacred and should be left as they were.

...unless a profit can be made

Above all, money decides many things in this new world today.

[emjel]

A thumbs down from me.

why cant fans be content and satisfied with Fifties masters in Mono !!!

You play around with it in stereo then you might as well whitewash history.


Drop it Ernst

But if they do it, the originals will still be there. They won’t get rid of them so you can enjoy whatever turns you on.

good one emjel,

that's not the point.

It would be unethical to play around with Elvis, Scotty, Bill, DJ Fontana and Sam Phillips artistic integrity. The Sun records are sacred and should be left as they were.

Another angle to look at this; when you are producing a mono-to-stereo job, what determines what instrument goes to the left side? what determines what instrument goes to the right side? And on later RCA masters where do you pan the Jordanaires vocals to?.... was Ernst there?
Would it all be based on researched guesswork or subjective decisions according to what sounds best to the given producer's ear?

Well you could look at it another way. How do you know where The Jordanaires were in the studio on many of Elvis’ recordings. Sometimes we get a song on a record where they are on the left channel and then another time on another release, they are on the right.
And is that placement based on where you are looking in the studio ie are you looking at the studio from Elvis’ vision or are you looking at directly at him as if you were in the control booth.

When you listen to a live recording, are you listening to it as if Elvis is looking at the audience or are you listening to it as if you are in the audience. By the time they have fed the sounds into a 4 or 8 track recorder and then mixed things around, I doubt you would have any idea where certain things were actually placed.

You see it doesn’t really matter in the grand scheme of things and I think you are just looking for reasons not to accept such a thing happening.

But if you don’t like whatever it is they decide to do, if they decide to do anything, then simply don’t buy it and carry on listening to the originals and let others enjoy a different sound - one that is likely to be closer to how it sounded in the actual studio at the time before the recordings ended up in mono format.

[emjel]

I have an opposite angle, why aren't more of us calling Ernst out on the lack of 2 or 3 cd box of Elvis' sixties and early 70's authentic Mono singles as produced by RCA? These are a glaring omission in the Elvis recorded legacy.

Shame that more of us aren't complaining about it.

Maybe those tapes have been ditched so they only have the multi tracks available which means they would have to do bounce downs. But would they be exactly the same as the mono versions they mixed down for the original singles and could you be really sure. Are the few mono variants that FTD have put out within their Classic Album series taken from the original mono tapes that produced the original mono albums or are they simply recent bounce downs from recent digitised stereo tapes.

That’s why I did needle drop recordings of all my Elvis singles and compiled a couple of CDs because I knew then that I would be listening to the original mono single versions without any doubt whatsoever.

[Gary Crawford]

Do we know how Harbour Lights and When It Rains It Really Pours survived the tape purge? Random chance? However, given they would know these tapes had not been released, were they kept for this reason and if so why not Satisfied.....?

Both "Harbor Lights" and "When It Rains It Pours" survived because they were not sent to RCA's storage facility in Indianapolis in 1957. They were only kept by happenstance. No one felt they were releasable items until producer Joan Deary went looking for unissued material.

"Satisfied" was lost because it was on one of the 8 reels sent to storage. Sadly some of the original Sun reels, and some of RCA's copies of these reels, were NOT sent to Indianapolis, and yet are still LOST. Painful.

See more here:

Master & Session: Sun Recordings
http://www.elvisrecordings.com/sun.htm

Thanks. Painful indeed. More hope for the ones not sent to Indianapolis having initially survived and possibly 'helped' out of an RCA building and sold on, but if so seems likely they would have surfaced somewhere by now. However even the ones sent to Indy, you'd think if just getting destroyed some RCA employee would have seen the value in keeping them for themselves. Perhaps the policing of the tapes being destroyed was really quite strict for fear of them falling into the wrong hands? However it didn't seem to stop master reels they did actually deem important to keep finding a way out of their storage facility...